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 Rear speakers (currently 536 views) |
| Chris S |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 7:46:26pm |
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When I got my car it had a board over the rear bin with speakers fitted in it. I hadn't realised it wasn't standard until I saw other photos on this forum. Anyway, the sound quality was always pretty poor so i thought I'd try re-making the shelf using some 16x9 drivers that were going unused in another car:
The original board with speakers removed and the new one - freshly cut from 6mm MDF.
Holes for the drivers removed with the help of a smaller jig-saw blade.
The drivers and original support bracket bolted in place. I added a small brace to try & stiffen the shelf a tad.
... viewed from the front.
test fit in the car.
Now with the original (very much faded) grill cloth back on.
Fully fitted.
Sounds better than before, but still not great. Perhaps 16x9s are too big for the tiny cappo. I might experiment with some smaller drivers at some point. A proper cabinet, mounted properly in place of the plastic bins would probably make a big difference too. The shelf was always mounted rather nastily with 4 self tapping screws driven through the plastic bins.
Anyone else tried anything similar to this with good results?
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 7:53:34pm |
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| I wonder if sealing around the edge of the back of the board with some foam or something would make it sound better? |
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| Chris S |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 8:05:00pm |
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There's a rim of neoprene rubber foam stuck around the outside on the back, more to try & stop the thing vibrating than seal it up properly. It's good enough to hear what's being said on the radio clearly now so it'll do for the time being.
I think removal of the plastic bins & mounting of a proper cabinet in their place will be the thing to do, though this is now down my list of priorities a bit.
On the way home after fitting it, I kept turning the volume right down so I could hear the engine better anyway 
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Reply: 2 - 32 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 8:10:50pm |
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| A proper cabinet moulded to the shape of the original trim now that would be great! |
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Reply: 3 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 9:02:53pm |
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Yes, agrre with Andy.
May be good to replace the entire centre section of the plastic parcel shelf?
Maybe with something a little more solid than 6mm MDF, though - it's very thin stuff.
I'd prefer to use 12mm or bigger, or GRP, or both?
Have you bevelled the back edge of the MDF to fit snuggly against the plastic trim?
Bevelling would give a greater contact area for a makeshift seal so a neoprene strip should then give a good seal if the unit is seacured properly.
If only using a couple of self-tappers to hold it on it maybe moves around too much whilst the car is moving giving leavage around the edges even with using neoprene? Even if the board stays a good seal to the trim, the trim moves and is light.
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Last modified Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 9:06:48pm by crisp |
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Reply: 4 - 32 |
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| Chris S |
| Posted on: Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 9:51:05pm |
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Quoted from crisp, posted Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 9:02:53pm at here |
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Yes, agrre with Andy.
May be good to replace the entire centre section of the plastic parcel shelf?
Maybe with something a little more solid than 6mm MDF, though - it's very thin stuff.
I'd prefer to use 12mm or bigger, or GRP, or both?
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Hmm, it may actually be thicker than 6mm, it was just cut from a sheet I had lying around. It's a bit thicker than the one it replaced anyway
I agree completely that it's far from ideal as-is, but I was hoping for a fairly quick & easy incremental improvement over what was already there. To do a proper job, I think you're right - at least the center section of shelf has to come out. If a cabinet were mounted on brackets that secured to the two seatbelt towers it'd be solid enough.
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Reply: 5 - 32 |
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| mattjohns |
| Posted on: Sunday, June 1st, 2008, 4:17:47am |
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| I had much the same setup (didn't look that good though) with a pair of 10" subwoofers in 10 or 12mm MDF and it sounded OK |
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Reply: 6 - 32 |
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| Badger |
Posted on: Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 5:04:07am
 Attachment: moulded.jpg - 15.25 KB (506 views) |
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6mm way to thin.....may as well use cardboard or leave them on floor, Not being sealed won't help. Not like a 'Normal Car Parcel shelf, where boot acts as Cabinet.
Sorry, don't mean to sound 'orrible, but, need to be in a box.... 12-16mm for 'standard BOX', 19-----???, for Face only for SubWoofer enclosure.
As for Andys' suggestion....I couldn't agree more..... 
and before you ask......yes I atarted out with something similar and decided I could do BETTER. |
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Reply: 7 - 32 |
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| Badger |
Posted on: Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 5:32:01am
Attachment: front_1.jpg - 17.38 KB (495 views) |
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| Fits onto parcel shelf without the need for modification/defacement...is that a word...???, of any interior parts and uses seat belt bolts to secure it and acts like a strut bar. |
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Reply: 8 - 32 |
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| Chris S |
| Posted on: Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 12:52:06pm |
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Quoted from Badger, posted Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 5:04:07am at here |
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6mm way to thin.....may as well use cardboard or leave them on floor, Not being sealed won't help. Not like a 'Normal Car Parcel shelf, where boot acts as Cabinet.
Sorry, don't mean to sound 'orrible, but, need to be in a box.... 12-16mm for 'standard BOX', 19-----???, for Face only for SubWoofer enclosure.
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Don't worry, you won't offend me by talking sense
I'd like to have a crack at making a decent box at some point but too much other stuff to do at the moment.
I'm starting to think that the 16x9s are a tad to big when right behind your head (and I'm not at all after a really loud system) so it might be possible to mount a smaller box on either side & leave a tiny amount of extra storage space in-between.
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Reply: 9 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 1:54:26pm |
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| You could buy prefab 6by9 boxes and just mount them behing your board |
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Reply: 10 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 3rd, 2008, 7:27:44pm |
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The factory fit tweeters are really nice, tbh, but they need decent replacement footwell speakers for mid-range - and a sub to probably go on the parcel shelf.
Which reminds me - I still need to take my footwell units out and rewire them.
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Reply: 11 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Wednesday, June 4th, 2008, 5:01:30am |
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| I'm moving my sub from the parcel shelf to the front of the passenger footwell soon. They say bass is non-directional but from what a lot of people are saying on the audio forums I'm on (talkaudio etc) - that's b.s.! I can hear where it's coming from and I wish it would blend in with the front stage more! |
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Reply: 12 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Wednesday, June 4th, 2008, 9:17:35pm |
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Directionality allegedly is proportional to frequency, but you have to remember the bass units deliver a range of frequencies, some of which will be more directional than others.
What's your low-pass filter to the bass and high-pass filter to the rest set at?
If set too high then the directional effect will be far more noticable.
Also, all sound is dependant upon the natural direction of airflow, but also bass travells through solid mediums as well (the car frame and seat).
So, the faster you travel you will hear less sound from speakers that are behind you compared to those in front of you.
This should be far far more noticable in an open topped Cappo compared to a normal car, but this shouldn't be much at town speeds especially considering the close proximity of any rear speakers.
That reminds me, has anyone else ever seen the old b&w film on how sub-bass frequencies (~<15Hz) in cars can cause drowsiness? Like all Public Information films of the era it tries to be quite alarming. |
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Reply: 13 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 4:04:14am |
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I'm well buried into the world of mobile audio! The gear that's going into silvery over the next few weeks costed me about $6000AUD without all the cabling and installation
The focal sub I'm using (semi-active system) is crossed over about 40/50Hz and I can hear where the noise is coming from (only the really low notes that I can't pinpoint). Lots of speaker's frequencies can cross over into the other's if they are a good quality unit I'm going 3 way active with balanced lines, Time alignment (to help with speaker placement/distances, four amps (chrome!) and a JL audio sub that I have to make a fibreglass enclosure for - like Sneazas mirage ones!
I've heard sub-bass can cause drowsiness too - the thing that makes me drowsy on long drives is having the heater on (hottest setting) in the cappi without the window open! |
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Reply: 14 - 32 |
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| grant4561 |
| Posted on: Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 5:41:41am |
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| CG I think what Crisp is saying is that you must keep your Cappo below the speed of sound. |
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Reply: 15 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 10:55:23am |
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But 'sound knows no barriers' lol!
Even though I'm spending a lot on audio, it's a SQ (Sound quality) setup and not SPL (friggin' loud!)
I found that 'radio plate facia' thingie that was a bit broken today too |
Last modified Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 10:56:22am by capgun |
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Reply: 16 - 32 |
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| grant4561 |
| Posted on: Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 11:18:27am |
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| Great, PM me about the fascia or whatever. |
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Reply: 17 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, June 5th, 2008, 11:37:25am |
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| No worries |
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Reply: 18 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Saturday, June 7th, 2008, 3:45:38pm |
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Well, CG, you're not alone as I have heard of others that claim to hear deep bass directionally, though for most peeps they don't even notice much difference from FM radio to CD, yet alone anything else.
Mine on the other hand is getting noticably worse with age  , though still better listening to music than most folk I know.
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Last modified Saturday, June 7th, 2008, 3:51:02pm by crisp |
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Reply: 19 - 32 |
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| paolo |
| Posted on: Saturday, June 7th, 2008, 6:04:39pm |
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Pardon?
I'll get my coat |
Last modified Saturday, June 7th, 2008, 6:05:07pm by paolo |
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Reply: 20 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Sunday, June 8th, 2008, 1:36:53am |
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Quoted from crisp, posted Saturday, June 7th, 2008, 3:45:38pm at here |
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Well, CG, you're not alone as I have heard of others that claim to hear deep bass directionally, though for most peeps they don't even notice much difference from FM radio to CD, yet alone anything else.
Mine on the other hand is getting noticably worse with age , though still better listening to music than most folk I know.
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People that can't notice a difference from the fm radio to an audio cd? that's pushing the boundries! A bit like day and night! lol!
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Reply: 21 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Sunday, June 8th, 2008, 5:38:27pm |
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You'd be suprised at the natural lack of sonic perception of the local NEDs, CG.
Afterall, MP3 is king now, and in the most part that's far less quality than 16bit CDs.
Sneaza, how did you make your base section mould?
Did you make a mould from the existing parcel shelf in situ, or did you remove it then make a mould from underneath?
Just erhm interested *cough cough* that's all  .
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Reply: 22 - 32 |
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| Badger |
| Posted on: Monday, June 9th, 2008, 5:30:42am |
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Quoted from crisp, posted Sunday, June 8th, 2008, 5:38:27pm at here |
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Afterall, MP3 is king now, and in the most part that's far less quality than 16bit CDs.
Sneaza, how did you make your base section mould?
Did you make a mould from the existing parcel shelf in situ, or did you remove it then make a mould from underneath?
Just erhm interested *cough cough* that's all .
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Funny you should mention that....Notice the sound difference from my Ipod through my system is totally different than just normal CD, Volume is Compressed.... 
...as for the base section..... , I have to make a couple more, (The problem with different ideas...if only I could stop.... ), so what I will do is a 'How To' if that helps anyone, what do you think...??? Let me know. |
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Reply: 23 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Monday, June 9th, 2008, 8:14:12am |
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How to?
Yeah, sounds good.
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Monday, June 9th, 2008, 10:01:15am |
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More than the volume is compressed - a fair bit of sound quality too (a bit like saving a photo from bmp to jpg format).
I'd love a how to on the fibreglassing though |
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Reply: 25 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Monday, June 9th, 2008, 6:10:54pm |
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Going back best part of 10years I remember a lot of the fledgling MP3 sites SELLING tunes @ 128MBps and using really poor cheap cr#p algorithms as well - even taped worn vinyl sounded better, lol.
They weere awefully heavy with mostly metallic sounding artifacts. |
Last modified Monday, June 9th, 2008, 6:11:51pm by crisp |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 1:33:15am |
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I remember them too! You had to get the password to get them to work  |
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Reply: 27 - 32 |
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| Badger |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 1:42:10am |
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Okay, the 'How To' is up and running....BE WARNED....There is a LOT OF READING, trying to think of things before I actually 'Start' Pouring...... and thinking in general is killing me...lol. Never sat down to do this kind of thing, so if I go of on a tangent....like now...clip behind the ears to bring me back.
PS. Sorry for the thread Hi-Jack....Chris.S hope this all makes sense in the end. |
Last modified Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 1:43:08am by Badger |
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Reply: 28 - 32 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 7:06:19pm |
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| tutorial is great so far, thanks Sneaza |
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Reply: 29 - 32 |
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| Chris S |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 9:35:41pm |
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NP Sneaza. will be reading your howto with interest.
Everyday is a school day as they say.
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Reply: 30 - 32 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Tuesday, June 10th, 2008, 9:55:14pm |
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Excellent work on the tutorial so far Sneaza
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| Badger |
| Posted on: Wednesday, June 11th, 2008, 12:31:47am |
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| Thanx Guys....appreciated and more so if it actually helps anyone... |
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