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 New project (currently 1620 views) |
| crisp |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 18th, 2007, 10:29:38pm |
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I think the ones he has are older ones as most modern Wharfedale stuff is lets be honest cheap cr@p compared to the proper stuff they did 10/20years ago.
The ones I got ain't brill, but they are designed for larger heavier cabs, and tyhis does help.
Most Wharfedale stuff now is no more a decent make than Alba or Ministry of sh*te.
The ones I got are sold as HiFi speakers but most are 4Ohms as single drive units for the self-build market, but he does recommend them for the car, though I've not tried them, yet (I do have one spare somewhere?)
He does various sizes(4"/4.5"upwards + tweeters), mixed boxes, also what I would call starter packs (Pairs of mid+tweeter or mid+bass+tweeters), special orders, etc..
Many you pay more in p&p due to the weight with the smaller sets.
I do miss my old Wharfedales they were nice speakers, but not as nice as my 1980's KEFs, but a d@mn site easier to fit in a room!
As for the shelf compartment the idea would be to include a sub-driver and maybe the sub-amp/crossover in the middle section, ported around/over the rear window release catch rather than an open 'on show' speaker like a lot use.
The piccies I made don't do it justice as I just couldn't get it look like the 3D shape I wanted.
Probably means replacing the middle section of the existing shelf, but hey, it'd be worth it I think.
Not that this idea will come to fruitition due to current lack of funds, and it's really a winter project whilst the car is tucked away in the garage to avoid needless and repeated stripping/reassembling.
If it passes the MOT without any welding or nasty stuff then I might give it a serious try  . |
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Reply: 40 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 19th, 2007, 4:22:47am |
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| Just tell them it's standard, lol! |
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Reply: 41 - 84 |
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| crisp |
Posted on: Thursday, April 19th, 2007, 6:49:46pm
 Attachment: dsci0684a.jpg - 15.26 KB (419 views) |
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And to save anymore speculation about mine here's the Tweeters.
Factory fit I think?
I wonder if that capacitor/resistor is there because they are tweeters and need protection, or because they are Piezos and need toning down?
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Reply: 42 - 84 |
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| crisp |
Posted on: Thursday, April 19th, 2007, 6:52:33pm
Attachment: dsci0673a.jpg - 17.69 KB (420 views) |
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Here's the main speakers.
Pioneers of some variety, not sure what model.
Aren't these dual-concentrics?
Strange thing to put in a car with dedicated tweeters.
That could account for some of the sound problems I get.
BTW had it running some Led Zepp today and those guitar rifts sound awesome out of those dash mounted tweeters!
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Last modified Thursday, April 19th, 2007, 6:53:09pm by crisp |
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Reply: 43 - 84 |
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| DickW |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 19th, 2007, 9:06:37pm |
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Strewth.... You don't need a horn then !!
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Reply: 44 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 5:00:42am |
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The top clarion ones are the factory tweeters (silk dome). They aren't bad but not high-end. The other 'two way' 6 inches are something that the previous owner has put in. If you listen to and buy some good component speakers (splits) then you'll be a lot more amazed! 
Looking at the two ways, if you get panel vibration it's more than likely around the back edge of the speaker cage/basket where it meets the inner panel. If you put a ring of foam between it the problem is usually solved. Sound deadening helps 100% too!
For memory everyone has the tweeter location but I don't think every capp has factory tweeters - the wires are just there for them. I put my focal tweets there instead of the clarions. |
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Reply: 45 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 8:17:15am |
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Yes, Jay put the Pioneers in last year.
I personally wouldn't have put 'dual-concentrics' ('2-way' as you call them) in with a car with separate tweeters because then you've got 2 sets of tweeters : one set directional and one not-so.
I can here the time lagg and also a dedicated mid/bass speaker for the same price would be far better quality.
If there's then a level miss-match between the old tweeter and new mid/bass driver you have to change or add a resistor on the tweeter.
Eg. if the tweeters are far too bright then add a small resistor in series with the existing one that's on the tweeter (see pics).
Because of this it is often better to upgrade to a matched set of mid/bass+tweeter so that this is already done for you.
Like the Alpines Andy was looking at. |
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Reply: 46 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 12:43:33pm |
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| I have now bought a set of Alpine components so I'll let you know how they sound. |
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Reply: 47 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 4:39:22pm |
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| Alpines will sound great - they usually do! |
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Reply: 48 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:08:58pm |
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The ones you were on about?
I'd be interested to hear what they're like!
Are you keeping the Clarion tweeters in, or replacing both tweeters sets?
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Reply: 49 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:13:32pm |
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| Yep the Alpine SXS-1757s. Found an ebay seller doing them for £49.95 delivered. I'll try them with the Clarions first and swap them and see what the difference is. Will also depend if the tweeters fit in the dash too. Bought some Dynamat Xtreme to do the speaker are too. |
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Reply: 50 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:26:07pm |
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What official size are the Clarion Tweeters?
I'd guess at 1"?
The Alpines say they are only 20mm so probably should fit, but might be loose if owt?
Only one way to find out .
Just been on the Alpine site and there's no trace of these speakers, so they must be discontinued stock, thus the bargain.
Just cause they're not tomorrows models doesn't mean there's owt wrong with them at all!
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Reply: 51 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:29:03pm |
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| I looked too and they list the 1750 model which seem to have a lower spec. |
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Reply: 52 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:41:47pm |
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There's no SXS models listed at all.
It would I think have fallen under the Products/Speakers/Custom Fit Speakers.
There is, as you say, only the SXE-1750S set that is the nearest.
These are notably cheaper I see @ £35 compared to yours £50.
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Reply: 53 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 9:46:43pm |
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| That's £50 delivered though. The speakers themselves being £39.95 |
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Reply: 54 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Friday, April 20th, 2007, 10:24:44pm |
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That's not bad at all, either way.
Should sound NICE ! |
Last modified Friday, April 20th, 2007, 10:25:06pm by crisp |
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Reply: 55 - 84 |
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| mattjohns |
| Posted on: Saturday, April 21st, 2007, 8:36:52am |
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| Andy - When you had the covers off the headrests, did you notice wheter or not you could screw a second seatbelt guide onto the other side - for racing harness. |
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Reply: 56 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Saturday, April 21st, 2007, 9:15:15am |
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| There isn't a metal plate in the other side sadly. I think the ones that are installed are welded to the posts that go into the seat back as they feel very solid in there. These posts form a U shape sort of arrangement through the foam. I wouldn't have thought it would be viable (as it's not impossible) to put a second bracket in there. |
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Reply: 57 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Tuesday, April 24th, 2007, 7:51:39pm |
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| Well I can now say that Alpine SXS-1757 will not fit straight into the kick panel. Can't remember which site I found their mounting depth of 51mm on but it was wrong. They are actually 61mm and the magnet fouls the bodywork. |
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Reply: 58 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Tuesday, April 24th, 2007, 10:07:42pm |
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Sounds like you're going to have fun modifying it  .
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Reply: 59 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Tuesday, April 24th, 2007, 10:12:11pm |
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I'm going to have to use some spacers and modify the kick panel. Luckily I have a spare set! I've been out with my torch and it all should work. Just really annoying as going from the data I found they should have just slotted straight in.
Now how the hell do you make spacers?!  |
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Reply: 60 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 10:37:32am |
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| Cheated and ordered some ready made spacers so everything is back on track. Hopefully! |
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Reply: 61 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 3:21:00pm |
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Spacers are SO easy to make it isn't funny!  Just need a jigsaw and electric drill. Mark out a circle - the inner size of the speaker hole next to the magnet and the outer edge of the speaker (with some extra mm around it. Cut the inner section first with a jigsaw (drill a hole big enough for the jigsaw blade to fit through first). After you have the ring, put the speaker inside and mark the speaker holes onto it. Then you just use a drill for the mounting holes... |
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Reply: 62 - 84 |
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| Olyfan |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 3:38:00pm |
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............and all that trouble just to listen to Sporty Spice  |
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Reply: 63 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 3:38:42pm |
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| My hands aren't steady enough to get a smooth enough circle using a jigsaw. For the sake of £10 I wasn't prepared to mess around |
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Reply: 64 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 3:39:17pm |
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Getting her new album today too!  |
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Reply: 65 - 84 |
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| Olyfan |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 4:03:36pm |
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Hey I'm really p*ssed off!
One of my all-time favourite bands - Wishbone Ash - was doing a gig near here recently - and I only just heard about it  |
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Reply: 66 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 4:48:13pm |
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| There's still plenty of dates on the tour are any of them near enough? Obviously not as close as the Guildhall but... |
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Reply: 67 - 84 |
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| crisp |
Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 7:02:57pm
Attachment: speaker_adapter.jpg - 3.43 KB (279 views) |
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Should be easy enough to do, but would have been an even better oportunity (if you were installing concentrics which you're not) to redress the directional imbalance by making a beveled one.
ie. thinner at the drivers side and thicker at the engine side to make it point towards the inside of the cab better.
But you just went for single diaphragm main units + satalite tweeters didn't you?, so the difference in sound would be far smaller that with the concentric style.
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Reply: 68 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 10:42:10pm |
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| The speakers are already turned in slightly but an angled spacer would help even further. It would have to be very thin at the front, like on your mock up, and then very carefully measured at the rear to make sure it didn't interfere with the accelerator. |
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Reply: 69 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 10:48:57pm |
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Oh, yes, s-t I forgot about the accellerator pedal - yes I remember now from looking the other day, there isn't much room if any for this mod, is there?
In fact I struggled to get one of those poppers out because the pedal mechanism was in the road.
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Reply: 70 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 10:53:29pm |
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| There is a bit of room for manoeuvre but not a great deal. For it to fully work you may need to modify the kick panel as I will be doing. Basically I will remove the end of the panel which covers the speaker area. The metal brackets have already been trimmed in a suede effect foam so that they blend in. |
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Last modified Wednesday, April 25th, 2007, 10:54:26pm by Andy |
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Reply: 71 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 12:18:50am |
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I havent got to that part yet (kick panels!)
I will be cutting (relieving) the area where the speaker sits next to and making a custom grille to sit over the top of it. We're really limited in what speakers we can put in the stock locations without spacers... Any really decent speakers will need more room than what can be accomodated usually (without going to the doors). |
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Reply: 72 - 84 |
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| Andy |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 12:22:12am |
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I'm just doing away with that area of kick panel completely.
I know a mounting depth of 54mm is fine which was why I was so confident that the Alpines would fit no problem as I was led to believe they were only 51mm. |
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Reply: 73 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 8:11:22am |
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54mm=~2"
That's not much is it?
I've just checked some (HiFi) 4" drivers I had to hand lying around just to give some idea of proportion and they certainly won't fit
Luckily car drivers do tend to be shallower.
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Reply: 74 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 1:32:01pm |
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4" drivers are usually too small to reproduce all the frequencies accurately, 6" and up is the norm (Unless the 4" drver is part of a 3way component setup...).
Some companies have slimline drivers but they are usually a bit of a compromise. |
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Reply: 75 - 84 |
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| crisp |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 6:12:17pm |
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The 4" one was just lying nearby, spare.
Bought 2 (for the garden) and got a third free.
But, yes, they are bass-light, being only 4" and all: as expected.
You really need at least 6" for any reasonable bass.
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Reply: 76 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Thursday, April 26th, 2007, 7:03:07pm |
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| Agree - I like a small sub too although not always necessary! (I have a 8" focal sub in a sealed enclosure behind the seats). I just want my capp fixed so I can keep working on it! |
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Reply: 77 - 84 |
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| mattjohns |
| Posted on: Friday, May 4th, 2007, 9:23:00am |
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| I have 6.5" rockford fosgates in the kick panel area with matching tweeters in the dash under the windscreen and also another pair of tweeters at the very very front of the kick panel (see pic) facing up at me. I am also halfway through making an enclosure for two 10" subs. I like it loud. |
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Reply: 78 - 84 |
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| capgun |
| Posted on: Friday, May 4th, 2007, 9:35:59am |
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| Two ten inch subs in a capp will be very loud! Post some pics when you finish! |
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Reply: 79 - 84 |
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